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--I think, per country quota system was framed with diversification as underlying principle, not discrimination.

Depending on which country you are from, it may seem like discrimination or fair system upholding diversity.

If you are from India, you would hate it. There are truckloads of programmers in that country. But if you are the only graduate with programming skills from a country like timbaktoo (?), you would love it. You also got a shot at american dream.

This EB quota system reminds me of Caste reservation system in India. To some that is fair, to others, it is unfair. Depends on which side of the fence you are.

Fairness or not is not the issue. Question is can it be challenged in a court? Diversity at work place is encouraged through outreach for example. But you cannot discriminate in employment based on national origin. Employers can't put quotas for employee diversity. Employment based immigration I don't think can count because part of the requirement for holding the job is that the employee have a valid work authorization.

For example, someones H1b 6yrs runs out the without possibility of extension, you cannot cry discrimination from the employer for not hiring you beyond 6yrs. As I said, the employers don't force you to not change job or job title. People don't because they will lose their GC or spot in the GC queue.

As an unrelated side note, the current quota system is something that has evolved from past policies some of which was used to restrict citizens of certain countries.

yes there are numerous articles about that too. Atleast for IT folks things are ok

Yep.
So what you are saying, in other words, is 7% limit is for every country in the world (Except USA:)) correct?

www.notcanada.com


Its blatant racism here. THe population is aging and the government makes a big chunk of money via immigration fees.

Agreed this is discrimination, what stops us from fighting this discrimination using legal class action lawsuit? Is it the money required or did a lawsuit fail earlier that inhibits us to file class action lawsuit?


I agree with some senior members when they say that no one individual will come forward for the lawsuit . And I ask why should they ??

And I think, even if one single or 2-3 people do come forward it will not be possible.

This is the reason we have forums like our IV so that all can come together and take a decisive step together
.

Who can stop IV to file a lawsuit USCIS ? NO ONE

Many members went on blabbering about how long the process is and how expensive it is ... REMINDER if we can come together and collect upwards of 35k FOR "Lobbying Efforts" we can definitely collect funds for a lawsuit.

Some one here rightly said ...If we are retrogessed and there is a queue ..Is it because of you or me ?? NO it is due to the inefficiency of the USCIS.


NO ROAD IS EASY IN THIS BATTLE..... AND ALL OPTIONS SHOULD BE EXPLORED

Again , I want to reiterate , I think if IV core takes lead...hires a good attorney ....we will have funds for it....we have proved it in the past that IVians can contribute

your views are correct and analysis looks o.k. too the problem is even the genuine ones get flushed away ..survival of the fittest is not working now at all !!! say a person from worldwide comes in eb3 and say he is just a car mechanic (I know few from south korea who are in this situation) ..they get GC faster than Indian / Chinese EB2 / EB3 applicant (with 10 years experience and good bank balance)
and Karma means ..do your work / duty and don't worry about results ..we need that ..i.e SEVERAL SMALL Campaigns (since big is not possible now due to members leaving IV / getting dejected that nothing is happening etc etc
let us not analyze and discuss too much ..we talk a lot and hence the karma that we get is more talk from so called Experts ..lets do numerous small campaigns ..at the very least people will start coming back to IV plus new memberships

I am India EB2. Labor cleared 2 years back, I140 cleared more than 1.5 years back and I485 pending for more than a year. Have EAD and AP.
Currently continuing under same employer with I797 valid till Dec/2008. I will complete 6 years of H1 in Dec.
I would like to change to a new employer with a new H1.
I believe I am eligible for a 3 year extension based on above conditions.
My question: After I get a new H1 and invoke AC21, but supposing old employer withdraws I140, what happens to the new H1?
Since it is to be issued for 3 years based on labor/I140 cleared etc., what will be the situation if the underlying I140 is withdrawn by original sponsoring employer?

How much are you paying to get the pre-approved labor? The law to ban it is coming soon. So you may have to do it fast.

Thats true. By the way, I saw Janak saying somewhere that labor substituion should be banned. Its nice to see that he changed his mind. Of course I do believe that it should not be misused, sometimes it saves your life here which is more important if you are with family and trying to settle down here.

Anyway, before OMB approved substitution ban, file ASAP.

If all IMV memebers ever come to form a political party, people like you should be avoided. For you it's all love for YSR..where as for others it's not about YSR or CBN. It is about there values and what they stand for against (corruption, blood politics, land grabbing and so forth..)


Since you dont have your GC details filled in your profile, I would assume your interest in this website is not related to immigration. You might come back arguing that your GC process is about to start or this is public forum and anyone can post anything.

Now, looking at the pattern of your postings, you seem to bash YSR, Jagan clan of people. (Not that I like them)..It looks like you have other political interests in this bashing as against genuine concern for people, 'coz you dont seem to acknowledge that TDP is a corrupt party. I am sure you are a pro-TDP, pro-NTR,NBK(iether by caste or whatever).

If what I think you are is what you are, then its people like you who are responsible for the rise of these kind of politicians.

Hi All,
I am starting a new thread to clarify a roumour I heard that begining August 2006 the labour substitution is not possible. Can anyone confirm this please.

Thanks

unless someone has some concrete information to convince me otherwise.

the visa lottery has not been discontinued, CIR 2007 would have done that- if it had seen the light of day. dems will never let it go if they control things. pubs hate it on the other hand..

People can loose a lot of money in this "business"... 20K in 4 years is petty... literally.

Once you achieve some level in this business, your "uplines" start pestering you to do 300PV every month instead of 100PV. Each PV is about $2.50 + tax + Shipping so 300PV = $800 a month. Most of this $800 stuff is at least with 300% markup and many of the things that we didn't need. So even if we take $200 as waste out of $800, in 4 years, I lost $200x12x4 = $9,600

..

Thanks for explaining how this works!! I only avoided them and never heard their pitches, but looks like they go through an awful lot. No wonder why they keep at it even if everyone avoids them like plague. Now I am feeling sorry for all the cold shoulders that i gave them so far. Anyway, those ppl have reduced in the bay area somewhat..I am here since more than ten years now and I have seen that the folks that keep pestering me out in the malls, Kohls, Target etc are dwindling. Maybe they are coming to their senses and learning that there are decent ways to earn money.

Having said all these, someone was suggesting that we maintain a central database and malign them further. Thats pure evil man! Why go to these extremes? Just ignore them and they will go their way - yeah they are a nuisance, but nothing more, right? They are still humans!

Very well said & I just feel the same...I have already lost hope on this GC and can not predict how long its going to take but for sure before I leave this place and go back to home country I will contribute my best of share in this fight for justice and full support...count me in with out any doubt!!

If at all anything would work for recapturing of visas, its going to be lawsuit. There are already 155 ppl supporting lawsuit and saw ppl in are also thinking of lawsuit. I am sure there will be many more to support lawsuit. If we don't try for recapturing of visa nos, India EB2 ppl will be stuck forever, even for ppl with earlier PDs (2001-2003) it won't be before 2010 or 2011 that they would get their GC.

I am a CP case(EB2 india, PD dec 2002, my case is stuck in mumbai consulate), so maybe I can't be a petitioner in the case, but beyond that in regards of monetary support, helping in research etc, count me in.

I think the point some of the attorneys are trying to make is that there were quite a number of extra visa numbers available (close to 40,000) apart from the normal visa numbers available for Jun, July, Aug, Sep. Unless the number of approvals come close to the total visa numbers available, there is no reason for CIS to arbitrarily move the date backwards. You were right in saying that there were a number of approvals in June, but I highly doubt they even came close to the extra numbers available. All the attorneys are trying to say is to not consider the number of applicants from the equation of trying to predict priority dates.



USCIS had approvals before dates moved. USCIS knows the number of such approvals.

These approvals are getting GC before approval of current applicants. If earlier approvals use up quotas, retrogression does not have to wait for current approvals.

I know people who got their GC in 7 months from the date they filed PERM. and then there are many people getting GCs every month. There are both good stories and bad stories to tell about getting GC in US.

There were times when H1 quota never reached the limit during the whole fiscal year, now they get used in just 2 days. This mess in GC process is a result mainly due to our own actions (temporary workers and consulting companies hiring temporary workers). Do you think majority of us once we get GC, stay with the consulting company that filed for our GC? When a consulting company files for PERM, they already have a foreign national working under H-1B in that position. So where is the real intent to hire an American when some foreigner is already working at that position?

This employment based GC is a way for us foreigners to immigrate to US easily at one point. Now due to our extreme usage and abuse of this process, there are genuine people who are being sponsored to immigrate to US are also suffering. In a true employment GC scenario, the company should be desperate to keep you for a long time (more than 6 years after H-1B is maxed) for your valuable skills that they were unable to find in others. But in most GC cases, looks like we temporary workers are more desperate than our employers for the GC? aren't we? Do you see any companies sweating on how to retain you with them, because you H-1B is expiring and they have no way to keep you?

Do not put all the blame on US immigration system, the majority of the blame should fall on us and the companies who are helping us to get GCs when our cases are not based on genuine sponsors.
You are just looking at a few rotten apples in an apple farm ..here....Just like software or a server, a system should be robust enough to endure abuse, if it does not it should be modified to do so....no one is stopping DOS/USCIS to put in more checks and ba;ances for GC or H1 Process.....question is will they ever do it...probably not...look at how CIR failed....So you have to look at the oeverall picture rather than pointing at isolcated cases of abuse....which are neglible compared to valid employment based GC cases.

The US immigration system is broken and everyone knows it. That is why Microsoft opened new office in Vancouver.

Moderators , Pls delete this thread. Why is the thread posted on a immigration forum. :mad:

I completely agree with amitjoey and willigetgc.

Blaming IV on one hand for the lack of enthusiasm and support from EB3 community and on the other hand - for a stand-still in the Congress when it comes to EB specific bills/laws is inappropriate. And then asking IV to drum up a fake EB3 relief measure to encourage this community is a disastrous way to go.

I recently spoke with one of the admins (reached via contacts page) who gave a very realistic view of how things stand in the Congress and otherwise...and I truly encourage other members to talk to the right folks to get facts rather than getting misled by pure rhetoric. I trust that IV core advocacy wil identify the right bills/legislations to push for and hopefully regional grass-roots members will support those efforts. This Diversity bill might prove to be good practice but we should not have any false hopes. it just gives us another reason to blame IV later on - and IV is the only true platform we have.

Other than that let me just paste the following I wrote on another thread in response to Plainspeak's approach -
You do not represent my opinions. So please stop advocating yourself as an EB3 representative. With the points you have raised and the negative vibes you have created between EB2 vs EB3, you have shown that you are concerned and frustrated only about your own personal GC situation and are trying to use the EB3 tag to shove it down my throat. Which I completely detest.

Let me see if I understand PlainSpeak's language:
1. IV core needs to put a lot of resources to lobby for the DV bill, knowing full well that this bill will go nowhere!

2. Raise a false sense of hope among the EB3 community, again, knowing full well that its going to be dashed - just so that IV gains the trust of EB3 (I am EB3, and they have my trust without your logic!)

3. An exercise to gain trust by misleading!:D

I wonder why IV core did not come up with this brilliant idea ;)

And what reason might that be? To be born in an insanely ridiculously pathetically gutterish country like India you need to have been a sinner in your previous life.

Have some respect for your motherland. The country may have its problems and it may be heading for the worse - thanks to our politicians. You can point it out and take actions like emigrate elsewhere. But you dont have to get insultive and abusive of the soil you grew up on. In doing so, you only show the meekness of your character.

I am working with my company for last 3 yrs on H1-B. I have an approved I-140 and I am filed under EB3.

My H1 expires soon and the employer is going to apply for an extension. After that, they plan to file a new labor for me in EB2 and port the EB3 PD; once the EB2 I-140 is approved. My current title is "Software Engineer". They plan to file me as "Senior Software Engineer". My experience before joining my current employer was 7 yrs.


Is this a legally advisable/feasible scenario? I do have EAD and want to make sure I keep my options open. Given the current scenario, it may take a while to get the new EB2 labor and I140 approved.


Is there is a risk to my existing approved I-140 in this?


Please advise.

Read in the middle of the page....

"Though the principal employment-based categories are current for July, future retrogression is possible later this fiscal year, particularly if demand for immigrant visas increases substantially. Visa numbers can retrogress in the middle of a month and become unavailable without prior notice. If there is a mid-month retrogression, USCIS could elect to stop accepting adjustment applications. While this is unlikely to occur in July 2007, it becomes more and more possible as the fiscal year progresse"

Hope this help

http://pubweb.fdbl.com/news1.nsf/9abe5d703b986cff86256e310080943a/8d3d061006d75c47852572ff00687697?OpenDocument

Ok, if the Fragomen page is the source of this rumor: can someone who is a Fragomen client ask their attorney about what's going on here. That might help clarify things a bit. (Given that they are the largest immigration law firm, there's bound to be many IV members for whom Fragomen is preparing documents.)

Read my previous post explaining how things would work without country limits.
All you need to do is recall basic probability theory from school. No country quotas is the only fair way to go, as it would give any individual a fair go, regardless of nationality. I thought this premise was self evident.. but evidently, I'm wrong, and there is some explanation to do.

I hope explaining the facts and reasoning helps, and the feeling that "country quotas protect smaller countries" has nothing to do with the old saying:

"When you rob Peter to pay Paul, you can always rely on support from Paul"
:rolleyes:

We are all in this together, guys... As per the original intent of the thread, we were supposed to discuss whether the 7 % quota is constitutional. That discussion is not yet settled.

The main point is, based on current caps and quotas, all of us are stuck.

One way or another, we need to (A) raise number of EB visas, and (B) Eliminate quotas which distort the market and give unfair advantage to one nationality over another.

--What you said sounds very interesting. But it got me thinking, what if the merit is equally distributed by the country of origin and there is a limit to the opportunities this country can provide?


Let us say there are 140,000 EB visas given every year. Based on pure merit and sans any regard to nationality. Don't you think it could potentially lead to more visas being consumed by one country?

What if this country wants to ensure diversity to its social fabric?? How do they go about doing that?